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TWB/TCB, CFF, CFG etc    
Gulliver

Gulliver



  6/4/2021

Does anyone have a recommendation for which to use as a returning player?

Back when I was playing C3/DS regularly, Gizmo norns were the hot new thing, but I understand they're now more of historic note than anything else.

So... what would you recommend I (re)start with?

I want to say CFG because, well, gizmo norns... but the CFF 2017 breeds seem to be the new standard and likely for good reason.

To what degree are they cross-breedable?

TWB/TCB's sound interesting... how much do they differ in practice?

The other question is, of the replacement genomes, are the Mall Pack breeds' differences generally kept, like do CFF Toxic norns still need to eat things that would kill other norns and are Hardmans still little thugs?

Thanks!

 
cyborg

cyborg



  6/4/2021

I'm pretty sure the breed differences remain with all alternative genomes. All I know is that TWB/TCB don't crossbreed well with other genomes because Dragoler, the creator, said so.
 
Dragoler
Wrong Banshee

Dragoler
United Kingdom  


  6/4/2021  1

I can confirm that TWB/TCB genomes do not crossbreed well as their changes are extensive. In practice, if you are using the most up to date released version the differences you should notice over other genomes are as follows:
- Become hungrier less frequently than most genomes with the exception of 2017s who also contain full hunger fixes (hunger drive emissions tied directly to storage chemicals + a lobe to prevent overeating from CFF), creatures also become hungrier when they are more physically active.
- Temperature sensitivity, creatures in cold environments feel cold and in hot environments feel hot. Resistance to the cold depends on how much insulating fat a creature has on its body, and heat resistance depends on hydration level (if they are too dehydrated they will eat to gain water).
- No random shivering, most creatures shiver when they urinate, when TWB/TCBs shiver it is because their body temperatures or external environments are too low.
- Breeds easier than CFF but less often than most other genomes, females dance when aroused not just fertile, pregnancy costs resources so starving females cannot become pregnant.
- More expressive, looks sad when really hungry.
- Most norn breeds have an innate fear of grendels and will attempt to flee by escaping through doors. They are also more likely to fight back.
- TWBs have a slightly easier time falling asleep when they lay down.
- Non-aggressive breeds are more polite, will hit each other less frequently and won't steal apples out of each others hands.
- Can survive underwater for longer (assuming the water is heated, as hypothermia can set in quickly with frigid water) and will be forced out when they start to drown (assuming they have a navigable path back to their "home" ).
- Stronger immune system completely dependent on vitamin C in the diet, which is gained from eating all fruits. Can be injected with small amounts of antigens which will not harm the creature but will make it start producing cells that pump out antibodies.
- Generally better navigation than most earlier genomes, may have a small amount of EE resistance.
- The spirit of all official breeds remain the same but now Toxic Norns and Magma Norns function differently.
* Toxic Norns need to cultivate a microbiome of gut flora from eating trash which allows them to digest other foods. They are still harmed by medicines and antibodies.
* Magma Norns now dislike cold environments and enjoy hot environments, able to withstand and benefiting from internal and external temperatures that would harm other creatures (in other genomes they simply feel cold over time then go to the Ettin Home to stop feeling cold).
- Rare variants.

And probably more smaller things, not going into the inner workings. To function well the genomes require heat patches for the C3 Ark and there are a few community made rooms that are simply too cold, which along with the lack of crossbreeding compatibility are the only real drawbacks. But then I made the genomes so i'm going to be a bit bias.


Creator of the TWB/TCB genome base.

 
Malkin

Malkin
Australia  
Manager


 visit Malkin's website: Malkin's page at CWiki
  6/4/2021  1

There's a guide for how to set your world up for TWB/TCB creatures at the creatures wiki, if you'd like to give them a go. I believe they also have several of the gizmo features, just implemented differently.

My TCR Norns
 
Gulliver

Gulliver



  6/5/2021

Thank you Dragonler for your work on them. They definitely have a feel of earlier games' creatures. The stock C3/DS ones were much too locked on autopilot.

Malkin - I've had CAOS crashes all over the place using fixes from that guide in the past. At the moment, it's clouds crashing and autokill is dealing with them and a couple of years ago I couldn't run a world for more than 40 minutes before something on a timer somewhere made it unplayable that I narrowed down to one of the Norn Terranium "fixes". I don't know if one fix overwrote another or something.

 
Malkin

Malkin
Australia  
Manager


 visit Malkin's website: Malkin's page at CWiki
  6/5/2021

That's a pity - have you tried making a DS-only world for your TWB/TCBs with just the Capillata fix, Norngarden 1 and the Mushroom Forest? That should give your creatures enough heated space to roam and give you a try of the TWB/TCB goodness without a billion errors crashing your game.

My TCR Norns
 
Kirel

Kirel
United States  


  6/10/2021

Hi Dragoler, are the v2.5 TWB/TCBs still the latest version (https://www.creaturescaves.com/downloads.php?section=Breeds&view=547)? I thought I remember you saying you were working on v3.0 a while back, and I want to make sure I didn't miss you releasing them. Thanks!
 
DaedalusR

DaedalusR



  6/10/2021

The V3.0 TWB/TCBs were released in CCSF2019, here's the link.

https://ccsf2019.home.blog/2019/11/07/ccsf-day-y-twb-and-tcb-update/

 
Kirel

Kirel
United States  


  6/10/2021

Ah ok, yes, I do have the v3.0s, I just checked my downloads. So v3.0 is still the latest then?
 
Gulliver

Gulliver



  6/14/2021

Well, I've got things working. No idea how.

I've got a little run going of TWB and TCBs in C12DS. Having a bit of a problem with the multi-generational orgy that's been happening by the sunflowers, but some have made it further afield. A few even went down the lifts to the underground area.

I remember in C1, they literally had a wandering gene that told them to head east at a certain age because it's a flat plane from the hatchery to the grendel tree.

Having some issues with Draconians norns - one died of wounds (not sure what happened) and the attempts and cross-breeds haven't fared well. One had ATP issues, I think.

Might I suggest, if an update to be made, that you look at the relationship between crowdedness and moving away from each other. They seem to be quite focussed on recommending to push portals rather than actually just moving away from each other. They started exploring a bit once I'd broken the huddle a bit. Telling them to retreat from each other, go east, go west etc eventually started them off and now they suggest it to each other. Neat!

 


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