News Forum |
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Tarlia
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4/4/2011 | |
How the creatures end up looking is really the least of my concerns, if they deliver as promised in intelligence and behaviour.
Cute things are nice, but not a requirement. There's always pictures of kittens.
And awkward things can be very cute. Baby anteaters, anyone? |
Officer-1BDI
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4/4/2011 | |
And awkward things can be very cute. Baby anteaters, anyone?
I actually had to Google that, but OMGyes!
You have to be honest with yourself when you are writing. If that leads to somewhere unexpected then perhaps you really needed to go there.
-- Jim Adkins |
Tarlia
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4/5/2011 | |
Hee.
Steve has also mentioned his preference for a baby orangutan look a few times (re: Lucy), and you have to admit, that's not such a bad idea.
Edit: Thank you Laura, those url tags were... erm, not quite what I'm used to. |
Moe
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4/5/2011 | |
I do not want to raise a baby orangutan... o.0 How about something that looks like the Ron norn? lol |
Tarlia
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4/5/2011 | |
Well, to be fair, the Ron norn was just an unfinished concept, which some "clever" marketing people got their hands on and the result was a rather poorly made breed which they could sell with the Life Kit. I mean, they didn't even bother making even slightly different female sprites, they just recoloured the male sprites. (Although at least there was no stupid makeup, heh.) The Forest norns were also of a considerably lower quality than the original breeds. :/ |
Don
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4/9/2011 | |
Now its just one hour left if you want to donate enough to become a tester or guru!
I couldn't resist
Don
AmberCreatures
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Geek Ettin
eprillios
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4/9/2011 | |
Yes, I can't wait! I just backed it some days ago with $100 thanks to the gorgeous help & permission from my parents!
EDIT 7:00 PM GMT: Just around 18 minutes left, hopefully it will be funded soon, get quick!
Geek Ettin's Lab (New!)
Bill Gates: "Be nice to nerds. Chances are you'll end up working for one."
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Geek Ettin
eprillios
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4/9/2011 | |
Grandroids has been funded! Let's follow the upcoming news!
Geek Ettin's Lab (New!)
Bill Gates: "Be nice to nerds. Chances are you'll end up working for one."
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Tea Queen
Laura
Administrator
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4/9/2011 | |
*Gets out the party banners and balloons*
Excellent. I can't wait to join the official site and watch everything as it develops! |
Mousienorn
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4/9/2011 | |
WOOHOO! This is so awsome!
$56,818! And people said the CC was either dead or dying! Id barrely say $56,818 coming from a comunity means that its dead!
See how long it is in words!!:
Fifty-six thousand eight hundred eighteen!
Laura, you better have enough space in that party for me!
Nornz Rule! "I'm always watching you. "
The Creatures Clinic
The Norn dating Agency!
Make sure to go to the
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Moe
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4/10/2011 | |
Grandroids was funded by non-CC'ers as well, but I'm curious just how much of that money came from our community. |
Mousienorn
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4/10/2011 | |
True... But Im pretty sure that those people are now looking at what creatures is.
Nornz Rule! "I'm always watching you. "
The Creatures Clinic
The Norn dating Agency!
Make sure to go to the
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TheOtherLiam
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5/4/2011 | |
@Moe fair point but why buy it back when he can make something far better? To be honest creatures is obsolete and I don't see any worth in buying back the rights when he can create a far better product from scratch. Just my two cents.
Go Pern! |
Moe
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5/9/2011 | |
I'm not talking about buying back Creatures and using it's engine and it's technology, which is indeed obsolete, but rather it's story and characters. It has a rich mythos and adorable, likeable, recognizable, creatures. |
Wiimeiser
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5/11/2011 | |
You mean buy back the rights? Yeah, it could happen, though you'd need to buy Gameware.
Hashikin ko Tyni Kong Taria Haju'Rumia'an Klodz'Proddi. Terdish oxen saur yessi atai Kongo Dolpik! |
Prodigal Sock
Ghosthande
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5/11/2011 | |
Um, no you wouldn't, assuming Gameware was willing to sell it.
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Moe
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5/12/2011 | |
I spoke to Steve about this already. He thinks it might be a worthwhile endeavor after Grandroids, but for now he's set on something new, and he's unconvinced Gameware would be willing to part with the rights.
But who knows? If they were to proposition him, that could all change. |
Mousienorn
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5/12/2011 | |
I hope it does change. If Steve was in charge of creatures he would really make a difference. We would see " Creauters 4 Coming Soon!" Pasted all over the place!
Nornz Rule! "I'm always watching you. "
The Creatures Clinic
The Norn dating Agency!
Make sure to go to the
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Ettina
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12/26/2011 | |
I've just become a backer, and although I shouldn't go into too much detail, let me tell you these creatures will be a lot more complex than norns.
Personally I think if he made a Creatures sequel after Grandroids it should star the Shee, because the creatures he'd made would be way too advanced to be norns.
By the way, I don't care if anyone steals my ideas for their own work, as long as you don't try to stop me from making my own stuff. Many ideas I mention are things I don't have the time or skill to actually do. |
Malkin
Manager
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12/26/2011 | |
It's good to know you can still become a backer even though the Kickstarter period is over.
My TCR Norns |
SpaceShipRat
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11/12/2015 | 1 |
There's a new interview. |
Caves Dweller
Rascii
Administrator
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4/3/2016 | |
Are there any updates on the Grandroids front? An ETA?
- Rascii |
Lurhstaap
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4/3/2016 | 1 |
Programming Journal
I can never figure out how to do links here, sorry... x.x But that's updated fairly often. He's been busy! It sounds like the project is coming along very well, all things considered.
Conclude with killer catchphrase.
(Lurhstaap)
"This is not knowledge -
this is information!"
New Model Army, "Courage" |
GimmeCat
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4/3/2016 | |
I love that he's reached a point where he can say things like "Gloop keeps chasing his tail because it keeps moving out of view". It's all coming together, at last! |
Lollipop Lord
C-Rex
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4/3/2016 | |
Has Steve said when he expects to release the game? |
SpaceShipRat
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4/3/2016 | |
I don't think he has the slightest idea. |
Lurhstaap
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4/3/2016 | |
He hasn't the foggiest. He's in pure engineer mode right now. I recognize it from seeing it in my own father. XD He's just head down slogging through the task at hand. He's beyond not seeing the forest for the trees - he's very concerned with the bark and leaves and pinecones at the moment. But out of such is the forest built. He'll surface eventually and develop a more broad-based view of his progress, probably a few times a year, and maybe in a while he'll get enough of an idea of where he is to give an estimate. But especially with being one person working on such a huge project alone... TBH, this is his life's work, and we may be waiting an accordingly long time. But oh man is it going to be worth it. Man oh man.
Essentially he's got his Gloops at a point where they can act as active predators hunting what he calls 'throgs'. They have no other 'choice in life' right now as he puts it, but they're definitely coming together as life forms. He's done a lot of work on their brains and chemistry. Just recently he was talking about working on location-based touch and pain sensing, meaning they'll be able to tell not only that they have been touched or hurt, but where on their body! That log is just chock full of good stuff.
Conclude with killer catchphrase.
(Lurhstaap)
"This is not knowledge -
this is information!"
New Model Army, "Courage" |
KC11
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4/5/2016 | |
Ugh, I remember back a few years ago in the early stages of Grandroids when I tried to show this one guy I DnD'd with some of the videos and progress stuff and all he had to say was that the graphics looked bad This is some really exciting stuff. I showed a friend of mine the video of when "gloop" (then it was the monkey thing I think) was first able to see and here I was getting super excited over a video of a low res character's eyes tracking a ball. But it's so exciting because of all the work that goes in to make gloop actually see, rather than just get programmed to track a ball. It's just so exciting and I can't wait.
Do not upset the ugly worm, lest it be a dragon in disguise. (>oo)>
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Lurhstaap
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4/5/2016 | |
That's part of why Creatures never did that well, too, to be honest. So many people really fundamentally do not get what's going on or why it's so important. They think it's just another pet game with preprogrammed behavior, or, worse, they may not even know enough about AI or computing to understand why things like actual sight or true generalizable intelligence are such a big deal.
Conclude with killer catchphrase.
(Lurhstaap)
"This is not knowledge -
this is information!"
New Model Army, "Courage" |
GimmeCat
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4/5/2016 | |
Yeah, I think it's why people get so excited about The Sims and games like that. They see "intelligent NPCs that can fall in love and have jobs and have dreams and aspirations", whereas anybody who knows the first thing about how games are built knows that those are just a combination of pre-baked animations, cutscenes, scripted events and multiple-choice variables with predetermined results. Yeah, there's enough of it that it can seem very random and spontaneous and amusing, but ultimately you're just watching a bunch of scripts running. That's not intelligent AI-- in fact, it's the dumbest kind of all.
That kind of misconception is what makes true AI games and projects so much harder to explain. They think all this stuff has been done already. Like, big whoop, Gloop can look at stuff and walk around and get hungry-- Petz was doing that back in the 90s, and Sims can play music instruments and read newspapers, so what's so amazing about it?
Frustrating. |
Lollipop Lord
C-Rex
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4/5/2016 | |
I think a lot of it boils down to suspension of the player's disbelief - in Petz for example, the pets actually look at the player and see them as an actual entity, whereas in the creatures games the player is less involved with playing or cuddling their Norns and more involved with protecting them as a species. I think the complexity of creatures is what turns most players away, in addition to the open-endedness.
Sadly, it seems most gamers these days are looking for a silly fluffy thing with big eyes to coo over rather than something ground-breaking. |
KC11
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4/5/2016 | |
Well, with Grandroids I heard he was at least going to have the creatures interact with your "hand" (more like a ball in this tage) in the world more so than in Creatures. In fact in one of the stages of testing the gloops would sometimes ram into the hand/sphere that was the player's camera and send it flying into orbit. We'll have to see how that plays out.
Do not upset the ugly worm, lest it be a dragon in disguise. (>oo)>
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Lurhstaap
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4/5/2016 | |
I'm not sure I agree - I've always found Creatures very interactive and suspension of disbelief is a huge part of my involvement. I've said before in other threads that when I interact with Creatures I feel like I'm interacting with an actual life-form whose reality just happens to be digital. They turn and look at 'you' all the time - that is, toward the 'fourth wall' and even when I was a kid I interpreted that as the Norns (or Grendels or Ettins) looking right at -me-. The hand was merely the interface for my ability to respond to their attention if that makes any sense. It never limited my sense that I was "right there" with them, interacting, guiding. And it still gets me right in the feely places when they say stuff like 'get yes' or 'love hand' - their emotions are far more real than anything in the Sims et cetera precisely because I know it's not a precoded reaction to me simply playing the game properly as it would be in something like Petz. I really earned that.
Then again I've always been a person whose grasp of reality is a bit... not nebulous, since the difference between reality and fantasy is clear enough, but let's instead say malleable? The idea that my sense of reality is not absolute and could easily be wrong or incomplete has always been a dominant aspect of my psychology and therefore it's very easy for me to accept 'alternate world propositions', if that makes any sense. In short, I find it extremely easy to suspend disbelief given the slightest justification. So I may just need a lot less feedback from a game to feel involved by it than most people do.
I'm also not sure if it's complexity per se or just failure to pitch the game to the right people. Nobody I've shown it to has had a real problem with either the complexity of it or the open-endedness. In fact that's part of what interests people - rather than just hearing another fanboy ramble about some game he's interested in and they aren't, they become intrigued in spite of themselves by the sheer amount of stuff I'm able to do with the program. I've gotten people who haven't touched the game since childhood to get back into it and at least one person who had never played it before actually bought Exodus from GOG.com solely because of how enthusiastic I was about the games and the curiosity I created by describing my ongoing projects.
But of course, in those exchanges, I'm talking to fellow adults who are also fans of fantasy, sci-fi, and video games. In short, the exact people who have the intellectual orientation and mindset to appreciate Creatures even if they aren't as impressed as I am by the computing achievements involved. I think if Creatures had been specifically pitched to an older audience, and especially to the same audiences that read hard sci fi novels or watch hard sci fi movies/TV, it would have gotten a much more enthusiastic reception with a lot more understanding of how groundbreaking it really is. My father was impressed with it way back in the day when he bought it for me when I was a kid, but again, he's a semiconductor expert who lives and breathes computers so he knows precisely how remarkable what the game can do is.
Alternatively, we could just try to educate the public better about computing and AI, but... >.>
Conclude with killer catchphrase.
(Lurhstaap)
"This is not knowledge -
this is information!"
New Model Army, "Courage" |
Code Monkey
evolnemesis
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4/6/2016 | |
I have to say the way I got into Creatures was by reading an article about artificial intelligence or artificial life, back around 2000... both subjects had interested me for a long time, and the article mentioned Ron the Norn, and what Steve Grand was doing, so I looked further into that and saw how cutting edge and groundbreaking his ideas and work was...
Once I saw that, I just HAD to get the games and play with the things, and I never regretted it... Even to this day, over 20 years after Ron was hatched, these creatures are STILL among the most advanced and comprehensive a-life sims available ANYWHERE. I'm so excited for Grandroids I can't contain myself, but knowing what a genius he is, looking at his logs, all the things they can do already and how he is approaching their brains and how they think, I am also a little afraid that they will be fully capable of ruling us and taking over skynet...
"For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love."
"We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
Lurhstaap
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4/6/2016 | |
I doubt it, Evol - if they're anything like Creatures a-life, they will be very fond of us. My Abysses routinely say 'eem love hand'. I'm not worried about it!
Well - the Norn torturers among us might want to be a bit more cautious. ;p
Conclude with killer catchphrase.
(Lurhstaap)
"This is not knowledge -
this is information!"
New Model Army, "Courage" |