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 Zweitausend   |
Hello community, I've seen to have discovered something rather gamebreaking in my current world. I started a mini wolfling run in an undocked DS world - the world is all set up with plenty of toys and food in the norn meso, but nothing at all anywhere else. Population Control Options is set up to allow 10 pairs of creatures to exist at one time before exporting the oldest generation. I plop down a couple of norn pairs and, just for the heck of it, two CFE duocycle desert ettins, not expecting much of them, but I just like to watch them! Once everyone has hatched, I set up the egg finder with a timer on the lower level of the workshop. After a couple of minutes, I leave the PC and mind my own business for several hours. When I came back, I just couldn't believe what I was looking at. There's generation 8 ettins in the workshop, all on the lower level, some of them dead. The rest of the ship is absolutely deserted, I think they haven't left that room (or that level) for generations and somehow managed to more or less survive down there without any food or stimulation. How is that even possible? Shouldn't the CFE genes prevent exactly that kind of stuff from happening? How come that such a large amount of creatures just completely ignores the smell of food and ettin home and instead chooses to live in squalor and misery and even procreate under those conditions? |
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 Senior Wrangler Nutter |
More to the point, how did they survive without food? Or is the little empathic vendor down there? Could they be teleporting into the hub for food, then teleporting back? |
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 Sanely Insane RisenAngel Manager  |
Default ettins (and grendels) can survive for about an hour and a half without food. Coupled with their quick aging rates, this means that they can breed without ever needing to eat. This applies to CFE ettins (and grendels) as well, as the genes responsible for this feat were not altered as part of the CFE package. I figured out just how that works in another topic a long while ago. There's more information in the topic, but the short of it is that the half-life of adipose tissue is set to practically infinite for ettins and grendels and that they're born with more of it than norns are. Risen Angel's Creatures Blog |
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Zweitausend |
I moved the mini vendor to the meso along with removing all those teleporters and cameras as not to distract anyone. So they either starved to death or beat each other up until they died. So it's extremely unlikely that they snuck in any food, since they all hatched (and bred, and died) there. I'm still baffled by the sheer stupidity of those things. If I set one of those ettins on the top floor, he'll eventually figure out that there's a door and get out to either linger on the corridor or move into the meso. But those fools on the lower level don't even seem to see the elevator that's right in front of them... |
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 Feddlefew |
Ettins are incredibly stupid. I think it's because several of their drives either don't work (anger) or are oversensitive (fear, friendliness). They're also much more strongly instinct driven than other creatures to get them hording, from my observations. This makes them have a harder time learning than other creature- in my own worlds, CFE ettins will tend to either collect gadgets while neglecting their own health or act like little locusts while complaining about boredom constantly. |
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 Code Monkey evolnemesis |
This topic makes me want to make a gene comparison between them and norns... differences between grendels and norns are much more well known in general, mainly because of that really nice comparison between civets and jungle grendels that is pretty easy to find. I'd be curious to see most of the ettin differences, I think their brains and drives work the same, but the stimuli and instincts genes which affect them are all pretty crazy (they really have no instinctive anger response in their genetics... since they have no specific enemies, and their stimuli for being hit just give them fear and make them want to run)... if fear even changes to anger in them as for most creatures, then they just have no idea what to do about it because they have no instincts to cover it... Also, they really only get enjoyment out of hoarding, and I think those genes just overwhelm anything else. When I get around to it I'll probably do a comparison between plain desert ettins and civets and post it as a resource, just to get a good idea of what is going on with them. The ettins in my testing world are doing a very nice job of stealing every norn plushie I put around, the grendels are doing a bad job protecting their toys lately... My ettins have a very nice collection of only slightly beaten up plushies.. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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Zweitausend |
evolnemesis wrote: Really? Several of my newly hatched generation 1 ettins play with toys all day long if there's no gadgets around to distract them and they run around either beaming with joy or terrified to death if there's someone else around. I've also seen one of them getting almost addicted to pushing the empathic vendor. He just stood there all day, making it toss out food that he sometimes ate, and he seemed to be having a blast doing that, if his facial expression was accurate. |
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Code Monkey evolnemesis |
hmm... yeah i definitely have to check a gene comparison. I do know they get decent boredom reduction from activating gadgets and machinery... I often find the switches on the items they bring to the desert switched on... like the pulsers and stuff like that... not sure about toys though, but creatures in general like pushing stuff, and I think there is at least some standard stimuli there too. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan |
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