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 TheSecond    |
I've been testing Paradox norns with the aid of Feddlefew. For a supposedly toxic breed, they are surprisingly susceptible to ATP Decoupler -- but not in the way one would expect. When injected with ATP Decoupler, the Paradox Norn's Energy levels skyrocket and ATP levels plummet -- as they would in a non-toxic breed, however -- ATP Production does not zero out. In fact, one test subject I injected lived for well over a minute before dieing. Now, according to the Creatures Wiki, ATP Decoupler in a Paradox Norn should metabolize into ATP, ADP and Air; however, the ATP Decoupler in the test norn was not metabolized, the amount of ATP Decoupler injected never dropped below the amount injected. Would anyone with some skill at genetic engineering be able to help me solve this puzzle? My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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 Feddlefew |
If you upload a paradox norn to the adoption section (doesn't mater which norn, as long as it's a first generation) I'll take a look with Live GMS. |
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 Malkin Manager |
In most genomes, 1 ATP Decoupler reacts with 1 ATP to produce 1 ADP and 1 ATP Decoupler - so it is replaced by the reaction. My TCR Norns |
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TheSecond |
'Tis done. Chell will be ready to begin testing just as soon as she is approved. My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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Feddlefew |
ATP Decoupler also does some other things to a creature's metabolism. For instance, the presence of ATP Decoupler seems to speed up the rate at which energy and ADP become ATP. A lot. |
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 Leporidae |
Chell . . . You named her that on purpose, didn't you?  |
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TheSecond |
Malkin wrote: I see, I see. I was wrong in my Creatures biology. Something very odd is going on then. Lemme open the genome again and see if I can brave the murky depths for clues. @Leporidea - What? We're going to enjoy some delicious cake together, that's all. >  Found this interesting bit: 338 Biochemical Reaction 1 ATP + 1 ATP Decoupler -> 1 ADP + 1 ATP Decoupler And this: 849 Biochemical Reaction 3 ATP Decoupler -> 123 ATP + 3 ATP Decoupler Baby Both 128 850 Biochemical Reaction 3 ATP Decoupler -> 123 ADP + 3 ATP Decoupler Baby Both 128 851 Biochemical Reaction 3 ATP Decoupler -> 12 Air + 3 ATP Decoupler What on the good green earth is going on here? My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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Feddlefew |
I see what they did. Who ever made this tacked all of the genes that would make them immune to toxins and have instincts to eat them on the end of the genome. Because of how crossover works, a creature is going to inherit all or none of the extra genes. Since all of the normal toxin genes are still intact, ATP Decoupler is still deadly- while the norn's ATP supply is replenished by the paradox's additional genes. I bet what's happening is that norn's energy is being depleted by the rapid cycling of ATP and ADP. BRB. Hey, did you use the same norn for both the cyanide test and the ATP Decoupler test? |
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TheSecond |
I think so, but can't be sure. I'll test again. Injected Chell with enough Cyanide to kill 1000 norns. She's metabolizing it into energy it looks like. My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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Feddlefew |
Okay. Did you inject any other chemicals into your test norn before you got to ATP Decoupler? |
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TheSecond |
This one, no. Previous ones, yes yes yes yes no and no. Shall I inject some other toxins one at a time and wait s few minutes to see what happens between each injection? My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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Feddlefew |
I figured it out. Cyanide won't kill them. ATP Decoupler wont kill them. Cyanide and ATP Decoupler is fatal- but only if exposure begins in quick succession. I'll have the screenshot up in a second. |
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TheSecond |
Edit: After reading your last post, hatched a fresh paradox norn. Injected her with only ATP Decoupler. She was dead in ten seconds. A second (Or is it tenth?) test to confirm, fresh norn, no food, no toxins, injected with ATP Decoupler; dead in 13 seconds. OK. Belladonna: Increase in Pyruvate, decrease in Cyanide; after two minutes, still alive. Geddonase: The toxin is metabolised very quickly, moderate increse in pyruvate. Still alive after two minutes. Fed the test subjects lemons, carrots, justanuts. Fellow test subject (toxic norn) dead (tilde)five minutes of eating, Chell is still alive. More to come My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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 Sanely Insane RisenAngel Manager |
If anyone's interested, I ran a gene compare between the Paradox genome and the ChiChi genome (which the Paradox Norns are based on) and copied the results into a .txt file. Risen Angel's Creatures Blog |
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 Puddini |
I think my mind took the shape of a pretzel trying to comphrend this. |
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Feddlefew |
I think this problem might be fixable by creating copies of the 6ADP + Energy -> 6ATP gene and the associated "presence of cyanide stops process" receptor at the end of the genome, and then unchecking inverted in the receptor copy's box. That way, when cyanide is present in the creatures system, that version of the gene will take over and the norn won't die. |
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TheSecond |
That sounds very much like Greek to me. But it's worth a shot anyway. Downloaded the genetics kit last night (thanks again christina), so I think this evening will be spent trying to make sense of this *grumble* genome. Edit: Made the edits suggested. With Cyanide and ATP Decoupler in the norn, it works. With ATP Decoupler only, a second test norn was dead within 30 seconds. Getting there... but not there yet. The ATP Decoupler is still not being metabolized. Edit: I take that back -- it's being metabolized very slowly. Fed test norn #1 (Cyanide + ATP Decoupler) lemons, carrots, justanuts. The Cyanide level was quickly reduced and as soon as the Cyanide level hit 0, the norn was dead. I'll keep fiddling with the genetics and see what I can mess up. My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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Feddlefew |
I'll make my own version and test it later tonight, and see what I can do. |
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TheSecond |
Wait on that. I made an edit to gene 850, 3 ATP Decoupler + 1 nothing = 12 Air + 3 ATP Decoupler. Changed the reaction to 3 ATP Decoupler + 1 nothing = 12 Air + 1 nothing. Norn survived an injection of pure ATP Decoupler. Now just need to test more. Thank you very much for your help so far, I really could not have done this without it (your help that is). @Grendel Man - that would be interesting to see, though I doubt I would actually understand any of it. Could you pm it to me? My favorite norn is still Belldandy. |
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