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 NeoQwerty   |
Right, so everywhere I look, people are saying that I need to get Slink's Grendelworld, or referencing a how-to with starter worlds where Grendels are breedable, which leads me to conclude there's a script in the original World.sfc that prohibits Grendel breeding. Edit to change the question: I want to have both Norns and Grendels breeding... And for future aim, Ettins and Shee. The search and replace contained in the notes at the archive for Slink's Grendel world says "Search for: doif gnus eq 2 Replace with: doif gnus eq 9" Is that going to allow every species to breed? (Norn, Grendel, Ettin and Shee?) Is this something I can turn into "do this if genus is X to Y"? Am I going to get unexpected crossbreeds? Edit for a thought: This is CAOS, isn't it? Can I actually inject new code lines that would log Grendels separately from Norns, then? As in, put population caps on the Grendels as there are on Norns? Because that just hit me staring at these lines. |
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 GimmeCat |
Ok, I went digging into this for you, because I'm curious about this as well. The quick answer to all your questions is: it entirely depends on what exactly F**K does. The script in full is this:
This is either the 'hit' or the 'activate 1' script. I don't know how to reverse a CLAS so I don't know for sure. Either way, it starts off testing whether the thing being hit is alive. If not, nothing happens. Then it tests if the creature doing the push/hit is a Grendel. If so, the result is an automatic punch, regardless of intentions. The line you edit changes this test from '2' (Grendel) to '9' (null). In other words, the test is skipped, because there is no '9' genus. The rest of the script happily doesn't check for genus anymore, so once you get rid of that test, Grendels can do anything a Norn can. Theoretically. I may be reading this wrong, but I don't think there's anything in there stopping a Grendel breeding with a Norn. There's a Norn population check, but everything else just checks one species (read: gender) against the other. It asks: "Am I male? (yes: +1) Are you my gender? (no: +1) Are you fertile? (yes: +1) Are you old enough? (yes: +1)" and if the result is 4, they F**K. Otherwise they hit, kiss, or tickle. But it all depends on the F**K command, which isn't me being rude, btw. F**K is a hard-coded process. I don't know off-hand whether or not crossbreeding is possible, because it may be that F**K checks the genus of each creature before mixing their genes. The existence of special 'Grorn' breeds like this strongly suggests that crossbreeding is not possible, and the only reason that could be (since we can edit everything else) is the F**K command. I suspect there is a really easy HEX-edit one could do on the F**K command in the game's executable, but it would take someone like the Lone Shee to uncover it. |
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NeoQwerty |
Thank you for looking into this! The only documentation left in breedable Grendel worlds was these two search-and-replace lines and Slink's instructions to search and replace that in a hex editor, hidden in Treesprite's description blurb for Grendelworld. I'll have a look into peeling open the population raiser COBs and Grendel Friendly to retrace the relevant scripts. I know that, alone, Grendel Friendly only allows Grendels to stop being forced to punch Norns, but between backtracking, your digging, and Shee's Lost Secrets and the lists of CAOS commands for C2, I might be able to give the game a nudge. I mostly would just, y'know, prefer there to be population caps on all the species. I cringe just thinking about having 30+ Grendels and 30+ Ettins on top of 24 Norns in a small world like the default. Everybody would be distracted from eating and sleeping all the time! OK, so my plan of actions: Track back through the Friendly COB to confirm where the Grendels hitting script goes, see if THAT might not have accidentally brought some of the breedable Grendels possibility back (Because my last Norn? DEFINITELY tried to kisspop the sterile female Grendel in my world, but she only kissed and tickled and slapped.) Then track the Norn population cap, and see if there's any already around for Grendels, and if not, implement those. Last goal is figuring out a way to get to the F**K command and read it, which might take the same kinds of tools used to create a Gameshark code, if it's hidden in the .exe. On the plus side, I'm reasonably certain there's actually ways for me to track the game's memory addresses and narrow down the range to cheat with. |
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 Patient Pirate ylukyun Manager |
The Grorn issue isn't just about crossbreeding but about sprites themselves. In C1, the appearance gene only has an option for slot, not species, which means that creatures can only use the sprites of the species they belong to. Even if crossbreeding were possible, hybrids would only look like one species or another. The Grorn breed was created to allow visual hybrids e.g. Norn with Grendel legs. The F**K command (MATE in later games) is definitely hard-coded to disallow crosbreeding (or impregnation of males), hence the numerous add-ons to get around this. A hex would be great, since none of those add-ons have the proper fertility checks that the F**K/MATE command has. You might also want to check out Terra Nornia. I'm pretty sure it allows cross-species kisspopping, although the couplings are sterile. |
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GimmeCat |
I did not know that about the sprite limitation in C1. TIL! |
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NeoQwerty |
Anyone has a copy of the Norgrenorndels from Muppetboy's Geatville? GirlySatan is down. Those included sex-linked genes, so they could technically have Norns with Grendel children, and vice-versa. Implementing those on grorns would be the closest to crossbreeds the current engine limitations can handle. I'll have a few goes at finding where F**K is located in 5-6 hours. If nothing else sheer dumb luck and the kitchen sink might teach me some new stuff. |
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