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New norn breed with sprites for C1    1 | 2
Kule

Kule



  11/18/2016  7

This thread is mostly for self motivation. I'm open to critique and advice too, so please feel welcome.

I'm a long time creatures fan. C2 was the first copy I bought although at the time my PC couldn't handle it and would crash constantly which resulted in endless frustration.
I eventually replaced it with a copy of C1 which at the time I wasn't too happy about the idea (since it was an older game) but I'd go on anyway, sinking untold hours into it and keeping detailed family trees of my norns. Needless to say it forever holds a spot in my childhood memories.

Eventually I would go on to play C2 but along with seemingly many other players, it never clicked for me. The world and ecology was impressive but the gameplay and connection to your norns just wasn't there.

C3/DS was more of the same although at this point I was introduced to the creatures community and the wealth of agents and cobs online.

At this stage in my creatures fandom I dreamed of making metarooms, breeds and agents for the game but none of my ideas ever made it past the dreaded 'concept' stage, otherwise known as 'I don't want to put the real work in'.

If anyone remembers albia2k or gameware forums I made this concept



Sadly at the time that was the extent of my ability and even with good intentions and the help from other members the project never got very far.

It's always kind of sat at the back of my mind and after 11 years have passed I'm finally going to complete my vision.

The breed was always intended for C3/DS but after such a long time I feel those games haven't aged nearly as well as I'd have expected so I've gone back to C1 where my nostalgia remains. Turns out nostalgia is a powerful drug and has been a great source of motivation to this point.

Everything has been made from scratch with original breeds only being used as reference as I wanted to work at a higher dpi than possible with recolouring sprites.





This is all still work in progress and I feel some parts need fixing, such as the side head which was where I started.

All adult male sprites are done 100%, the ages will have slight differences. Smaller horns, etc.
Female will be a little more different but shouldn't take nearly as long now I have a base to work from.

I'll try and keep updates here as I go.

One side effect I'm aware of is the head horns will clip through scenery so I have plans to make an updated world file.. this obviously is a little way off at this point and once the breed is 100% finished I'll release as is.

 
ylukyun
Axe Maniac Diva

ylukyun

Moderator


 visit ylukyun's website: Engineering
  11/18/2016

Wow, these look incredible!
 
Kule

Kule



  11/18/2016

Thank you, that really means a lot! I've been working on these on/off since around august where I booted up C1 after many years and felt nostalgic.

The hardest work is out the way now and the remaining stuff to do is mostly tedious resizing.. which I think will test my patience far more.

After that I'll need a genome but I'm thinking about just releasing the sprites as is so people can make 'unofficial' versions with whatever genome they want. Depends how difficult I find the genetics editor.

 
ylukyun
Axe Maniac Diva

ylukyun

Moderator


 visit ylukyun's website: Engineering
  11/18/2016

If all you want to do is change the sprites, it shouldn't be too hard. I could give you a hand with the genetics if you wanted, although my experience with C1 is limited. Good luck with the resizing!
 
FaerieHawk

FaerieHawk
United States  


  11/18/2016

I just wanna say these look absolutely beautiful! I love the colors and their cool horns!

Between my love of cookies, tea, and the observation of genetics in nature I'm practically a Shee.[ngrin]
 
GimmeCat

GimmeCat
United Kingdom  


  11/18/2016

Stunning work- certainly some of the best and most unique breed sprites I've ever seen. Top quality stuff, please do continue it! :)
 
Norngirl

Norngirl
Sweden  

 visit Norngirl's website: Norngirl's Temporary Storage
  11/19/2016

Hi kule!
I do remember you and the artwork as well!^^
I was a member of that forum too :3

I must say you made a impressive remake of that lovely reptilian-dino like Norn of youe'se,it's outstanding and amazing!

I agree,C1 is surely keep a certain closeness when it comes to raise Norns.

C3-Ds may offer vasteness of agents as well offer more advance addon in the creatures genoms compared to C1 - still I can't help but they feel more robotic,knowing allmost everything right from theyre birth. With the help of genetic kit ,I know it can be sorta reduced back to the hand raising nostalgia if you remove some instincts,thanks to amaikokonut's lovely tutorial how to. But still, it isn't anything close to the C1

I also must say I do think C2 do come closest to c1 in term of bonding easier with Norns(they are not perfect,but Canny and other likes do make it a bit better but sill there is the challenge).
C2 do also have serious many bugs and in need of fixes,but I must say it still will be my one of my most fav over C3-DS (the Norns are extremly cute as C1 in design too in my openion).

Seeing a new C1 breed is really cool!
The only downside is the breed slots being so limited thought- did you have in mind wich it will override?

Perhaps you could consider later to let this be converted to C3-Ds,in the way Ghosthande made her adoreable C1 styled Wildkatt Nornst for C3-DS?


Can't wait to see more of this and wish you good luck in making this awesome breed! :3

-don't mind if I misstyped something,I might re-read everything and correct it eventualy -



Come and Visit my site: http://sites.google.com/site/norngirl...

 
NornBreeder

NornBreeder
United States  


  11/19/2016

I love it,
Hopefully I will see them marching around my world someday ;)

 
Kule

Kule



  11/19/2016  1

First I'd like to say 'thank you' to you all for the positive vibes and support. It's really nice to get a little input after staring at these for countless hours while gradually losing objectivity. Towards the end I was just working on auto pilot honestly.

I'd also like to thank you personally Norngirl as I always had your banana norn ref sheet up while working on these! Funny coincidence but I'm grateful as it saved me a lot of time and was nicely presented.

As for any ports to C2 or C3/DS I think I'll leave that to the community. For me this project is something fuelled by nostalgia and once everything is working in C1 I can't say my focus will remain.
I'm happy to provide the original 600dpi photoshop files if anyone else feels ready to take up the challenge. They're pretty messy at the moment but I can clean then up once I'm finished with everything.

It's a little funny really as my original goal was to create a tree cob for the garden and that somehow morphed into making a breed.. Maybe when all is done I'll return to that idea :)

Also about breed number, yeah it really sucks about the limited slots. I was thinking maybe about just making it for a few separate slots and then letting people choose. Personally I've always found santa norns a little lore breaking so I wouldn't mind losing them. I'll look into it a bit later.

 
Brynn

Brynn



  11/19/2016

Personally, I don't have much attachment to C1 (my game is and always will be C2) but I love the look of these! And it's nice to see they look decently happy, rather than a little discouraged-looking in the original concept art. They know they're coming to life!

Do these Norns have any "in-game" lore around them?

 
Kule

Kule



  11/20/2016

There is a lore reason for their existence and it's connected to the DS timeline. I won't get specific but it involves tea, quantum mechanics and getting unlucky with a planetary descent during an electromagnetic lightning storm.
Hope that doesn't sound too weird!

I have a rough comic sketched up which I made on the side to keep things fresh. If I can make it look good I'll release it along with the breed.

About C2, for me it's a very flawed game. I wanted to love it at the time but the world was so needlessly complicated and harsh. I just don't think it was designed too well in terms of gameplay.
If I ever get time I have plans to create an albia 1.5 for C1 which more closely bridges it to C2(before volcanic eruption) and changes the current C1 layout while retaining the original look. I've already designed the background (rough) and mapped out rooms. I'm also planning a 'quest mode' but it's something passive so won't break the sandbox flow too much. This new breed is directly connected and the changes are a side effect of their arrival.







 
Malkin

Malkin
Australia  
Manager


 visit Malkin's website: Malkin's page at CWiki
  11/20/2016

I love the design of the new breed - have you thought about making a wallpaper?

My TCR Norns
 
Kule

Kule



  11/20/2016

Currently I'm just focusing on getting them finished, I think if I start doing promo stuff now I'll lose focus but thanks for the suggestion.

I'll try to have the male and all life stages completed soon. Then if people are willing I'll need help looking for any major glitches with cross breeding and clipping.

 
Kule

Kule



  11/21/2016

Just getting my head around the joy of .att's..

short video with just the head and body sprites implemented to check everything works

Norn test 1

I noticed the sprites look low contrast/a bit blurry in the vid but that's not the case in the game from what I can see. Probably just compression issue.


As a bonus, here's a slightly amusing room clipping bug I'll have to fix >.<

elevator clipping

bonus 2

 
Liam

Liam
Australia  

 visit Liam's website: Spellhold Studios
  11/22/2016

Hah, hey Kule! I still have some of the original c3/ds sprites lying around I believe!

Looking good :)


- Liam / K'aeloree

Spellhold Studios, a Baldur's Gate II, Neverwinter Nights and Oblivion Modding Community

 
Kule

Kule



  11/23/2016

Hey Liam. My minds a little foggy.. but I can just about remember those sprites!
Long time ago now but I felt like an arse after losing interest.
Pretty sure soon after I moved on from the CC but once every few years I think back to the creatures series as even today there really isn't anything on the same level.

Hope all's good and thanks :)


 
Ghosthande
Prodigal Sock

Ghosthande
United States  
Manager


 visit Ghosthande's website: Breeders Beware
  11/27/2016

D'aww, they're so cute. [nhearts] I can remember seeing that original concept somewhere (not A2K... maybe Deviantart?) and wishing they were a real breed. Glad to see you haven't completely given up on them!

The shading is very C2-esque in a way, which is cool because there aren't enough breeds like that IMO.



 
Bifrost

Bifrost
Norway  


  12/1/2016

Is this what you were thinking of, Liam? I wish these would have been able to even come close to what you have done with this breed now, Kule. It's truly beautiful, and I really hope there will be a C3/DS version available.




 
Kule

Kule



  12/1/2016

Wow seeing those really inspires me to continue! The creatures community is truly one of the best.

I've currently taken a short beak from these to play through FFXV but soon I'll start start work on the females and thankfully they'll be a little more simple.


And yeah it would be nice to get them working in C3/DS after. If it happens I'd like to do a retro(C1) version first and a modern version using better shading. The current shading is pretty blocky as with too much information photoshop does a bad job scaling down. I have a few dislikes with the sprites too but I'm ignoring them until everything is done. I think I've just stared at them for too long so I'm mostly focusing on getting everything working in game, then at the end I'll clean up/replace anything bothering me.

 
Bifrost

Bifrost
Norway  


  12/2/2016  1

Graphically, I think your new design and shading looks a lot better than the more C3-ish designs. It's now smoother than the old C1 graphics, and could easily fit in with the C2 norns and C3 norns. I wouldn't change them much at all for a C3/DS adaptation. Split the tail from the body, and leave it at that.
 
Kule

Kule



  1/8/2017  6

Just wanted to do a small update before the thread drops off the page. Been really busy this past month due to holidays and I live outside of my home country so everything begins to be more complicated.

I have everything working in game now, sprites need a few touch ups to clean the black outlines which will make limbs look more seamless. Also might remove outlines in total as they're giving a bit of a cell shaded look but I'll test that when I do the female sprites and figure out what's better.

For now just a few quick example images:



double size


making friends
Image linked due to page stretching properties.

 
C-Rex
Norn King

C-Rex
United Kingdom  

 visit C-Rex's website: The Norn Nebula
  1/8/2017

Wow, nice job, they're awesome! I take it they're a C1 exclusive?

Come and join the Creatures Community on Discord!
 
ylukyun
Axe Maniac Diva

ylukyun

Moderator


 visit ylukyun's website: Engineering
  1/8/2017

They look fantastic, and blend surprisingly well with the game's art style.
 
Kule

Kule



  1/8/2017  1

C1 only for now but I'm not against porting them after at some point.
Actually I've had a few set backs that slowed me down a bit. Discovered norn pose for C1 (which is incredibly helpful) has a mistake where it shows background limbs in the wrong order. I was using it as reference so all my leg and arm background sprites were messed up when in the game and I had to go back and edit them all.

I also have a big appreciation for the original norn artists. I'm happy with how my sprites turned out but the original banana /pixie have a real life like quality to them which imo no one's ever matched. I was interested in who made them as for a game I'm really attached to I know very little of the creators besides Steve Grand.
Turns out the artist worked for Disney (not sure before or after) so that explains a lot, he was also in charge of designing the background and supervising construction.

 
C-Rex
Norn King

C-Rex
United Kingdom  

 visit C-Rex's website: The Norn Nebula
  1/8/2017  1

That's funny, because I've always thought the C1 Norns had a sort of disney-like quality to them which was sadly lost in the following games.

Come and join the Creatures Community on Discord!
 
cuil

cuil
United States  


  1/9/2017

These look fantastic! I was also around for the A2K and Gameware forums. I don't quite remember the original concept pic, but I do seem to remember the old sprites, funnily enough. I don't remember much else...

Gosh though, I really love the style! C1 is the prettiest of the games, in my opinion. That warm and cozy style and the 2D norns have always been close to my heart. I wish there were more 2D styled breeds, as they're my favorite!

I would offer to help out with genetics, but since it's been ten years since I last opened up a genetics kit I've forgotten how everything works! [ngrimace]


When life gives you flying lemons, make flying lemonade! ... Wait, what?
 
Kule

Kule



  1/9/2017

It's ok. My memory of those years at A2K and Gameware forums is still very foggy. Probably for the best that way, clouded by a slight mist of nostalgia :)

 
Norngirl

Norngirl
Sweden  

 visit Norngirl's website: Norngirl's Temporary Storage
  1/9/2017

Looks great so far,Kule! They look very neat ingame allready!
Im curious how the females will look once you do them.
I wonder if they will remain same but have someslight changes?
Hopefully will the females may have the classic C1 eyelashes? : D


Would look forward to see this guy's in DS,as im unsure what slot they will take in C1 (but that I allready did mention before)

In any case, it's sad the breed slots are so limited in C1,unless there exist a trick to it.
I also wish those neat Dragon Norns made by Kathira that was also originaly a C1 only breed,but got ported for C2 with permission
http://web.archive.org/web/20060619125046/http://germancreatures.net/c1/breeds/dragon/dragon.html

Perhaps they could be as well ported again for C3/DS with permission.But thats my opinion though. I hope you do not mind me saying your'e Dino like Norn breed do remind me a bit of the Dragons,
(the Dragon males being green and that the breed to is based on bananas). :3

Kule wrote:

I also have a big appreciation for the original norn artists. I'm happy with how my sprites turned out but the original banana /pixie have a real life like quality to them which imo no one's ever matched. I was interested in who made them as for a game I'm really attached to I know very little of the creators besides Steve Grand.
Turns out the artist worked for Disney (not sure before or after) so that explains a lot, he was also in charge of designing the background and supervising construction.



I been curious about this as well.
I allways admired the very cute big eyed sprites of C1 and
been wondering who was the one who did make the sprites of them.
All we get to know is that the person who was the concept artist (Mark Rafter,I guess?) worked in some way with Disney - wich surely is a neat fact but not a 100% who actually made the ingame sprites themself .
I also been wondering how the Norn sprite process where made- pixel by pixel drawn? Big drawings that got resized?
I suspect the latter might be it,as you can see some small colored pixels sometime visible the Norn heads if you look close.
Such as pink and green pixels found sometime on (mostly) baby norns head sometime. Perhaps I might include a screenshot on what I mean if you are not sure what I refer to.
In any case,I love sprites - I allways admired hand made sprites and think Creatures 1 has it's charm in the way it's bright,cute and pixel like.

Sorry for the rant there.
Anyhow - will be nice to see more progress of your'e breed!


Come and Visit my site: http://sites.google.com/site/norngirl...

 
Rha

Rha



  1/9/2017

Oh wow didn't see these before, they're great!


 
Kule

Kule



  1/9/2017

Hmm is there a time out on this forum as I just lost my post from an auto log out?

Trying to remember what I said now.. Females will be a little different, for one thing my niece told me they need to have pink on them so I'm thinking that will be their iris colour. Their body will probably be a light tan colour with soft purple highlights instead of blue. They'll contrast the males a bit but I'm sick of seeing green now!
Thinking about removing the cheek horns and giving more detail to the ears and jaw area as I was kind of restricted by staying faithful to my original concept. I might still keep the top horns but have them coming downwards instead of pointing up. Not set in stone thought but those are my rough ideas.


As for the original sprites I'm fairly certain they were made at higher resolution and as solid character images (not made limb by limb). Someone then had to cut them up into limbs and downsize them. Imo this wasn't a good system as it cause issues between cross breeding and you end up with the weird front and back poses where the wrong body is visible.

 
Kule

Kule



  1/11/2017  3

A little lore about the norns:

Originally the breed was going to be a 'dino norn' but after coming back to it years later I imagined it as something different.
A norn created by the last shee, born from pieces of genetic code collected while exploring worlds through the docking station. Later, as the banshee attacked his ship and out of desperation the last shee launches a single pod with the genetic code. The pod quickly activates it's warp drive (cobbled together from broken teleporters) and punches a hole through space on a course towards Albia. Upon entering the atmosphere the pod is hit by a shock of electricity escaping the volcanic storm, causing it to crash into the surface of Albia. Only problem...

The pod, half buried and sitting in soft sand. Waves lap the shore as a familiar tune plays on a nearby radio.. Something's gone very wrong!



The breed is a contingency plan by the last shee and were intended to arrive back on the destroyed Albia where they would begin to terraform and restore life. The pod is able to transform itself and provide simple food and education for the norns which luckily are resistant to radiation. The norns can absorb a small portion of radiation and convert it into food, they also have a high affinity for carrying and distributing seeds long distances. After living a long and healthy life, their bodies genetic make up deposits into the earth which over many years gradually decontaminates the area.



Enough fan fiction! :)


When I starting working on this it was mostly to recapture my original design and finish it with what I had learned up to this point. It's been fun but also a little limiting as the basic concept was something my 17 year old self came up with.

For the females I'm thinking of taking a little more liberty. I've done a rough mock up and tried to express a more organic feeling to her but also retaining some elements from the male. I haven't done the body but try to imagine it with little pink and white bits in places, behind arms and legs and I'll probably remove the tail spikes and curl her tail up a little. The idea was that she's a flower blooming and the female children and youth will look closer to the male as they haven't bloomed.


Would be good to get some feedback






 
BlocklockCity

BlocklockCity
United States  


  1/11/2017

I like where you're going with the female sprites. For some reason I wasn't expecting this breed to have substantially different sprites for males and females.
 
Kule

Kule



  1/11/2017

Neither did I until hour after hour of staring at the male sprites and resizing them a few hundred times. After awhile it really kills the fun so I'm taking a break and making the female adult now. I just wanted to gauge what people think before I commit to her design.
 
Malkin

Malkin
Australia  
Manager


 visit Malkin's website: Malkin's page at CWiki
  1/11/2017

I love the subtleties of colour on her skin, and the pink eyes are really something different. What does your niece think?

My TCR Norns
 
Kule

Kule



  1/11/2017

You're right.. she is my true critic ;) I'll have to wait until tomorrow due to time zones but I'll give an update when I find out!
 
ylukyun
Axe Maniac Diva

ylukyun

Moderator


 visit ylukyun's website: Engineering
  1/11/2017

The female looks great. Just different enough from the male. Reminds me a little of a PMN. If I have one criticism, it's that she looks a bit too shiny/glossy compared to the male, although it's not really that noticeable when scaled down.

I hope your niece likes her!

 

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