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Development Forum Encouraging Aggression    Lurhstaap        5/29/2016  1 I decided to make Abysses more aggressive, but I'm having trouble with it. In the past I was able to make Norns that hunted down Ettins with little trouble, going right to the Desert to do it, but the edits I remember making back then don't seem to be working. I'm either forgetting part of what I did or there's something different about this genome. It's the CFF I've been using for all of v2 development. Any suggestions on making a breed that's hostile to beings not of its species? They don't have to go to the Desert or Jungle like Hardmans do, but I do want them to consistently and without hesitation hit back when hit, and it'd be nice if I could get them to simply attack grendels and ettins on sight. That just isn't happening though. Thoughts? Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage"   Zurinsel13     5/29/2016 I am certainly no expert on this topic, but maybe if you edit the genes of your Abyss Norns V2 to make them happy, stress reliefed or pain reliefed after hitting ettins it might encourages them to be more agressive. ^-^ "Vision is the art of seeing what is invisible to others" -Jonathan Swift   Peppery One Papriko   5/29/2016 How about making the respective smells of those creatures enrage them? Though you probably already did this. Lets play plants! Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis... Photosynthesis...   Code Monkey evolnemesis   5/29/2016 One big thing to look at to make them better fighters is to get rid of any bolt reflex or indecision they might have when hit, and change it to an instinct to hit back... Go to the 'Creature hit me' stimulus... make sure the 'Reaction' is 'hit it', the significance slider is at least halfway, and the intensity slider is above 0 (the higher, the stronger the urge to hit back, but you should not need to put it very high...) some breeds and a lot of CFF have 'retreat' set here but with a low intensity. Normal genomes tend to have 'look (quiescent)' here... Fighters like Hardmen and other aggressive breeds want to hit back... The following are other things that will encourage aggressiveness which you may or may not have tried: Rage Neuroemitter: 'X is approaching' increases adrenaline and anger. (Highly recommended you have one for each breed you want to be aggressive to... norns and grendels both have a gene like this, and it is THE major thing that makes the C3 standard norns and jungle grendels fight) Instincts that hitting those other creatures reduces anger, boredom, and/or crowding. (you'll find standard genes like this, just copy them or alter them as needed for other genus.. most norns only have that hitting grendel reduces anger, and hitting norns reduces crowding, but grendels and fighting types tend to have instincts for all 3 targeted against their enemies) Make the smell enrage them or increase rate of fight or flight action. (standard gene 'Grendel smell'... make a copy for whatever genus you want to cause this) Silence or alter any genes that make fear from interacting with/seeing/smelling the other genuses... (hardmen have no fear at all of grendels, for example) Make them seek out 'enemy' creatures when lonely. (you will see this in the genomes of Hardman Norns and Jungle Grendels, and can copy if you like... this will make them very actively hunt down enemies) Then if you want them even more violent, you can make hitting more fun for them and make them want to keep hitting when they hit someone, by messing with the 'I hit someone' stimulus... make sure the reaction is 'hit it', and also have the stimulus give more drive reduction, maybe have it reduce boredom too... "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan   Wrong Banshee Dragoler     5/29/2016 I'll just add that giving them an initial concentration of Grendel Nitrate will reduce their inhibition to hitting creatures, but it will also make them more likely to hit everything else, too. Creator of the TWB/TCB genome base.   Lurhstaap     5/29/2016 See, this is why I'm so puzzled. I've done almost all of those things. Not ALL, but most. The only major difference is the Fear thing. I think that might be the problem. The way it's set up right now, they get some small amount of fear from being hit, but their instincts and stimuli are set up to give massive fear relief if they hit Grendels, for example. In short, hitting is supposed to make them feel braver and less afraid. But in practice that may be resulting in conflicted behavior and confused learning. They can be pretty effective, but they have a weird way of hitting a few times, then stopping and running away. Or I'll suggest "hit grendel" and there'll be this amazing ZOOM where they all rush over and cluster around the Grendel and it looks like an epic cluster-beatdown is about to start. But then they just... follow the Grendel thinking about hitting it but without actually doing so. It's as if something is inhibiting them, as when I was trying to get them to eat detritus. In this case though I'll bet it's that Fear thing. I'll remove all instances of Grendel related fear generation and see what happens... It is getting better though. I got one girl last night to unleash a really epic beatdown, though the Grendel didn't die, which confused me - maybe just because she was a baby and he was an adult? Is there an age difference modifier for damage? o.O For the Ettins, it's even more puzzling - they TALK about hitting ettins a lot, but they seem to prefer to ignore and avoid them rather than attack unless encouraged to by the Hand. I wish I could code more complex predatory behavior LOL - the way the Ettins flee from the Norns could be a great trigger for attack behavior if it could be set up, but I'm pretty sure the 'it retreats' flag isn't active. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage"   Code Monkey evolnemesis   5/29/2016 Yes, younger creatures have their damage (really not just the damage, the whole stim they give to other creatures when they hit them) reduced when they hit, in the game scripts... I think babies give only a 1/4 strength 'i've been hit' stim. They might actually be liking the creatures... any good ideas about the creature will inhibit any decision to hit them... This is more likely if they are in a good mood a lot of the time, because creatures in a good mood have a tendency to like anyone they interact with (or even approach/look at). You have a happy simple-minded norn, skipping along towards an ettin it wants to hit, probably enjoying itself the whole time, looking at the ettin, and so it starts to think 'hey everything's great! i'm going to meet a friend!' ... By the time it gets there, it already likes the Ettin, and because it's a Norn (no Grendel Nitrate) it has an aversion to hitting friends, so its desire to hit deteriorates. That neuroemitter that makes negative feelings and adrenaline when seeing the other creatures approach will help get them in a bad mood when those creatures are around and be more likely to get grumpy around them and not like them. But Grendel Nitrate goes even further... It will get rid of any aversion against hitting creatures they like so they can just follow their instincts. Also, definitely make sure the reflex 'reaction' to the being hit stim is to hit back. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan   Lurhstaap     5/29/2016 Ahhh, OK, that explains it. Do I have to set up a reaction for Grendel Nitrate to work or is it part of the genome already? I have hostility neuroemitters set up already, but maybe they're not strong enough? I did make sure their response to both 'I've been hit' and 'Creature hit me' is 'Hit it'. They're slowly becoming more violent in general - the tough part now is keeping the 'hit stuff' from generalizing too much. One of them in the current group has decided that it's really fun and awesome to hit food. He's killed so many tubas that way. XD Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage"   Wrong Banshee Dragoler     5/29/2016 They have rules set in their brain genes that work with Grendel Nitrate automatically. You don't need to set up any reactions, just an initial concentration and make sure the chemical half-life is set to maximum. Creator of the TWB/TCB genome base.   Lurhstaap     5/29/2016 Fascinating! So it's actually hard coded into their brains! How many other chemicals work that way? Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage"   Wrong Banshee Dragoler     5/29/2016 Ettin Nitrate causes a selective blindness for gadgets when in proximity to Ettin home smell, and in CFFs/TWBs, chemical 130 which triggers hallucinations is also hard coded into the brain genes I believe? Creator of the TWB/TCB genome base.   Code Monkey evolnemesis   5/30/2016 Yeah, Chem 130 effect is in the SV rules in their visual tracts. CFF/TWB also have enhanced randomness in the SV rules of the verb and noun lobes that make them more likely to try different things. They are still good at learning what works for them though. "For small creatures such as we, the vastness is bearable only through love." "We are a way for the cosmos to know itself." - Carl Sagan   Lurhstaap     5/30/2016 Yes, I have noticed that... they start out pretty similar as babies but over time develop very different preferences and enjoyments! I had one that loved to hit food, specifically, and another that became obsessed with "get (whatever)", so that she was always just standing or zooming around, grinning like a loon, with a toy or gadget or some helpless critter trapped in her hand. The suggestions they give each other start to get really interesting around 2-3 hours of age. Conclude with killer catchphrase. (Lurhstaap) "This is not knowledge - this is information!" New Model Army, "Courage"

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